Re: virus: Albanians and Zloduska's Rage

Sebastian Kinsey (drsebby@hotmail.com)
Tue, 30 Mar 1999 06:14:22 PST

Actually, i think an intensive carpet bombing might be a solution. Starting in Albania then running straight across, through Greece, then Turkey, Iraq, Iran, up a little bit so as to get Afghanistan ..next would be Pakistan and then...of course the Indian subcontinent. Imagine how many potential genocidal situations would be thwarted!

But how can you go off the deep end like...all your nasty insults, the cursing etc? Seems kind of like misdirected energy to me.

When i said 'Z and i have some sort of love hate thing going...' I never imagined you or anyone could have interpreted it as you did. I wrote that with a fond memory of your fierceness and confidence....it was something i had admired, regardless if you understood what i had actually said so long ago. But after this pitiful display of resurgent immaturity, i realize that i had horribly overestimated you. You are very literate, but i get the sense that you respond only to listen to your own voice.
>From: "Eric " <6ceb3@qlink.queensu.ca>
>Reply-To: virus@lucifv .com
>To: <virus@lucifer.com>
>Subject: Re: virus: "We will fight to defend the honor of our rocks!"
>Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 18:22:17 -0500
>
>Hi,
>
>Sodom < et
><<
>Their "goal" was to eliminate a political and ethnic minority (I am
>speaking of the Kurds). It was not to reloacate, share or get along
>with them. Gassing may be the method, killing is the goal. Is that
>wording better?
>>>
>
>Perhaps. If the US had offered to relocate all the Kurds, do you
>think Iraq would have objected? I still think it's wrong to view the
>situation in a simple us/them war mode kind of mentality -- both sides
>are human, and both sides would be reasonable if they thought it was
>going to benefit them.
>
><<
>This is utterly unreasonable - I suppose we could have let Germany
>March across Europe and the world, and stayed out of it beecause we
>wouldn't want to violate any "German Soldiers" rights?
>>>
>
>We don't have to violate their rights to stop them from advancing. If
>they become violent, we may be forced into a self-defence mode, at
>their loss. Whatever their goals are, it probably would have been
>easier (and less expensive) to acheive them in a cooperation mode.
>
><<
>That is what you are saying here, it doesnt matter to you what the
>pattern of behaviour is for a country - no matter how they act,
>responding withg the military is the wrong option? Is this reasonable
>and when this method has been tried, where are those countries now? In
>order to have this view you have such an incredibly niave view of the
>world as to make your opinion useless. You are not "lowering" yourself
>to that level by fighting.
>>>
>
>Controversy equalizes fools and wise men and the fools know it.
> -- Oliver Wendell Holmes
>
>Responding with the military on *offensive* is certainly the wrong
>option. A defensive stance can be justified, if no other, better,
>solution can be found. I am certain, however, that such a solution
>could almost always be found.
>
><<
>Fighting is not a universal measuring stick. Fighting and making war
>are not inherently wrong. By your argument, we dont need to go after
>killers with police, we should just be able to ask them to kindly come
>out and walk behind bars for us, maybe "Happy, Happy jail" messages
>will work?". Thats not the way it works IRL.
>>>
>
>We do not need to go after killers with police -- we need to chase
>them instead with goodwill and messages of peace. The reason that
>cops never fire first (and I hear don't even carry guns in England) is
>that the purpose of a cop is not to subdue the enemy with force. The
>purpose of a cop is help those in trouble -- and, in any violent
>situation, both the victims and the aggressors need help, just in
>different ways.
>
><<
>Thats exactly what you "want" it to be like - you think children
>"should" be some way. It simply does not work like that in real life -
>the first thing anyone understands is need and pain, usually related.
>Its what teaches you to avoid the flames. If you have no understanding
>at all, putting your hand in the flame takes but one quick lessen,
>even for the most mindless.
>>>
>
>True. But a far better solution is merely holding one's hand close to
>the flame -- or passing it through real quick -- to convince yourself
>that holding it there would be painful. And a uniqely human solution
>is to become convinced of the danger of pain by rational argument --
>which is both humanities profound strength and the source of some of
>our deepest problems.
>
>On a different note, I think that "pain" and "teaching" are not
>directly related;
>"pain" and "conditioning" are much closer. It is fairly easy to
>condition people (and animals) to avoid the pain, but you cannot teach
>a human anything meaningful by applications of pain -- merely motivate
>them to learn. It is my position that such motivation not only is
>less effective than other methods available (especially intrinsic
>motivation, from the individual themself), but that it also causes
>coercion damage, resulting in entrenched theories (e.g. the much heard
>"I can't do math") and a loss of creativity and motivation.
>
>
>ERiC
>

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