Re: virus: Re: Manipulation 101 Lesson 10

Eva-Lise Carlstrom (
Sun, 23 Feb 1997 00:33:48 -0800 (PST)

On 23 Feb 1997, David Rosdeitcher wrote:

> In a situation like this, in which we, ourselves, like people everywhere, are
> infected with various mind-viruses, understanding how manipulation and
> propagation of these mind viruses occurs is best shown through live examples
> from this list, as opposed to academic discussions. In situations where either
> Tad or myself are, as Eva would say, "using you as a Horrible Example", anyone
> is free to complain, especially if either of us is wrong. But, not that many
> people should be intimidated by our references to recent posts, since, even
> though most people, including me, are infected with virusus, there are very few
> people who deliberately manipulate others through spreading those viruses.
> These next few paragraphs explain that we are in an infected environment and
> that live examples should be used to explain manipulation.

I'm inclined to agree. The examples are far more concrete when we've just
seen them in action, than when they are hypothetical or abstract. What I
meant by 'dishonesty' earlier was the ingenuous claim not to be accusing
the source of one's examples of anything. If someone used something I
said as a bad example, I'd want them owning up to that, not getting coy
about it. It's also easier to argue against it, if appropriate, when the
claim is being made clearly. And that's what *I'm* here for,
anyway--hearing what other people have to say, and arguing civilly about

I do have a quibble with David R.'s usage of the term 'virus' here;
someone else mentioned it earlier too. All memes act like viruses, and if
one is to be a called a virus they all should, not just the ones we happen
not to approve of. After all, there's evidence our *genetic* structure
owes a fair amount to the infiltration of viruses into our cells long ago
(is it mitochondria that are thought by some to have once been viruses,
that moved in? anyone have a source to help me out here?), so we ought to
be willing to accept mental viruses as parts of ourselves as well.
Especially if we're calling ourselves Church of Virus.