Re: virus: Rationality

Alexander Williams (
Mon, 24 Feb 1997 08:52:03 -0500 wrote:
> > Memes are not /just/ little packets of information; think of your
> > memesphere as a `primal soup' of memes, some of which have greater
> > complexity than others, some of which are active enough that they
> > `reach out' of the primal soup and affect the world beyond (your
> > head).
> Is this the transmission and replication of memes, or are you talking about how
> they affect your actions?

Considering my Heretical stance on memes not being able to be
transmitted, it was more a visual metaphor for memes and meme-complexi
that `reach out' via causing the meta-organism (you) to change the
environment that surrounds it, causing new memes to arise via
observational input and changing the primal soup, the memesphere,

> So if we model memes as atoms then they build molecules, which build
> cells which build creatures? Does this necessarily mean, though, that
> rationality, which is more a system of coherent thought, than a
> packet or sytem of information can be classed as a meme?

Certainly; if we can hold the /idea/ of "rationality" then it is a meme
or meme-complex, and as such, both constructed by and a constructor of
other memes and complexi. Now, whether "rationality" has an objective
existance or is merely a `discrimination meme' (to reference earlier
discussion) is up for debate. My personal take is that "rationality"
has no existance save for our internal model; the physics of the
universe have no concern for "rationality" as far as our perceptions are

> Surely rationality is a method of interpreting memes than the actual
> memes themselves.

With what do you interpret memes if not with other memes?

[`If you work on your mind with your mind, how do you avoid an immense
confusion?' Obviously the old Zen Masters weren't familliar with
emergent systems theory.]

> I must point out that at the moment I'm more inclined towards the idea
> that rationality and logic are /not/ memes, but I wouldn't be asking
> if I were at all sure :)

How can you think about something that has to representaion in your

   Alexander Williams{}
The  Mekton  is a  powerful tool,  both  physically and emotionally.
There is something that  happens to an  enemy when he sees his  home
and family stepped on by a hundred ton metal man.    -- Arkon Verian
Of  all the weapons of the  Empire, the  greatest and most respected
were the Metal Knights.  These Knights had served the leaders of the
Bendar for Generations,   righting wrongs and  bringing  fear to the
Empire's Enemies.  It is  said that these  metal giants were  shaped
like men so  that the alien servants of  Evil would know that it was
Man who defeated them.
                               -- Scribings from the Murian Archives