RE: virus: Angelica de Meme

Wright, James 7929 (
Fri, 04 Apr 97 11:03:00 EST

Tad wrote:
>Here is my position on VotM: I think it is a very well written book.
>language is easy to understand. It is a humorous, inspirational great
>about manipulation, influence, and evolution. The Polish version of it
>be ready in May (it was supposed to be published in September 96, but
>translator, Marek, who was also on the CoV list has vanished from our
>meme-space in a mysterious way). Here is a translation of my Polish
>introduction to it, written on May 30, 1996 (the part about Marek needs
>be changed):<
AHA! Tad is openly in league with the GREAT SATAN/MANIPULATOR BRODIE! He
is SPREADING the contemptibly false MEME-LIE throughout Eastern Europe!
He is undoubtedly partaking of fine cognac and cigars, shipped straight
from Seattle, and accepting other remunerations from the EVIL ONE!
Now that I have gotten rid of my conspiracy-mania for a while, I wish to
label the preceding paragraph as a JOKE, for the literally-minded. Tad is
probably doing the people of Poland a great service by helping innoculate
them against future meme-complexes of questionable validity; having
suffered through Nazism and Communism sequentially, they deserve some
<Snip section of dust jacket text>
>Although with some of the book's statements it is not easy to agree, all
of them >encourage thinking. The authour writes about three levels that
people live their
>lives at. The highest one is available only to few. How can one reach
it? Does it
>exist at all, or is it just propaganda?...<
Did Brodie actually contend that the highest levels of creative thought
are only AVAILABLE to a few? Damn it, Tad, you've almost convinced me to
buy it!
<Snip rest of dust cover text>
>That is not to say that I wont be continuing
>to accept as many of your other memes as possible, you both have
>contributed elegantly at times.[TH]

>Thank you and you are welcome.[TN]
I second the opinion; this post is one of your best, IMHO.
<Snip backquotes, side discussion>
>We know memes or ideas or concepts exist and are transmitted in some
>from one person to another. Can we claim that because of this knowledge
>know how to live? <
I would hold that we do not.
>It's good to know the techniques of manipulation and
>*how* ideas influence people, but it does not answer any of the
>philosophical and psychological questions.<
Which particular ones did you have in mind?
>The fact that I know math does not make me an expert in any field which
>numbers. The knowledge of math may by necessary in that field, but it
>*not enough*. The knowledge about how to brainwash people is not an
answer to >their questions -- it is a good way of controlling them.
OK so far.
>A notion that you know how to live because you know how to program
peoples' >minds seems to be highly immoral to me.<
I missed something somewhere. Who claimed this?
In some previous posts I questioned what method [mechanics, if you will]
could be used in memetic engineering to create and test antibody memes
for toxic meme complexes. Nowhere did I suggest that I should be placed
in charge of identifying which meme-complexes were toxic, or who should
be experimented upon, or how.
Those people exist today who create memes, some of which are toxic; the
Bosnian conflict appears to me to be a product of such memetic
engineering by one group. If you do NOT engage in memetic engineering to
counter such toxic meme-complexes, are you not also an accomplice in
their success?
>In marketing, appearance is often more important than the product.
>can be sold if wrapped properly -- unless you learn how to concentrate
>the product and not on the cover. Any useless idea can be defended for
>long time with proper manipulation techniques -- unless you learn the
>techniques and recognize them.<
Not only useless ideas, but those hostile to the continued existence and
growth of a different population can be "defended" or spread; this may
explain some of Richard's reluctance to discuss the 4 P's. Since the
Internet is global, is it possible that some future nightmare may be
prevented thereby?
>My favourite example .... Nathaniel Branden's books answer many
questions >about how to live a better life. An excellent tool ...
Another required reading assignment. I shall go bankrupt at the
Thank you for an excellent post.