Re: virus: "the self"

David McFadzean (
Mon, 28 Apr 1997 16:54:28 -0600

At 01:20 AM 28/04/97 -0500, Mark Hornberger wrote:

>I disagree in that I think you are mistaking the word for the thing it
>refers to. The term "I" may create or affect our conception of what the
>"self" is, but it doesn't affect objective reality - if we were all
>illiterate apes incapable of abstract thought (of this magnitude) we would
>still be individual apes. We would perhaps lack a sense of self, or
>self-consciousness, but this would be a manifestation of our own
>inadequate powers of perception, not an indication that objective reality
>is fundamentally different.

You think we could be conscious without being conscious of the fact? That
doesn't make any sense to me. Or maybe you aren't talking about consciousness
at all.

> Language or the use of it may have
>ramifications in the objective world (the making of the hydrogen bomb, or
>the writings of Henry Miller) but this is I think on a different level
>than we started out talking about - the simplicity of "I."

If "I" implies consciousness it isn't simple at all.

David McFadzean       
Memetic Engineer      
Church of Virus