Re: virus: Re: Existence

Eva-Lise Carlstrom (
Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:49:56 -0700 (PDT)

On Mon, 8 Sep 1997, Brett Lane Robertson wrote:

> I have to speak up here, as this bit of argument makes no sense
> whatsoever, but several kinds of nonsense. Yes, you can have a brain
> without mind: a dead brain, or the brain of an animal functioning on a
> simple enough level that we do not consider them to be conscious
> (individual results may vary on this latter category). This has nothing
> to do with the question of whether there can be mind without brain.
> That's like saying that since I can have a computer but not send email, I
> can send email without a computer. Non sequitur! The characterization of
> brain as a product of mind is also bizarre; I would characterize
> them in the opposite way, with brain producing mind, or, better yet, call
> them different aspects of one phenomenon. (Carlstrom)
> Eva,
> Read what I wrote again. I never said that mind produced brain, only that
> mind was a process (in parenthesis that brain was a product...not saying a
> product OF what...). Also, I didn't say that because one can have brain
> without mind that one can have mind without brain...only that if one can
> have brain without mind then mind and brain were not dependent on each other.
> >>Can you have a brain without mind?
> >> (I'm assuming that you will say yes...which states that neither is dependent
> >> on the other, mind can exist without brain if brain can exist without mind).
> >> How? Mind is a process (brain is a product,,,can you have a process without
> >> an end product)!
> Actually, I never said that there is mind, at all (your email argument
> implies that there is email somewhere, my mind argument just says that there
> is a "process" of mind...never that there is a product called mind.) My
> argument can be restated: can you have frogs without toads (yes) then you
> can have toads without frogs (yes), the presence of frogs is not dependent
> on toads (no). What is the process of producing toad-frogs--and can you
> have the process without producing anything? What is missing is the
> mind/brain connection--we have a process of mind, we have a product called
> brain, brain can exist without mind, so what is the process which produces
> brain (which I'm not too concerned about) or what is the product of mind
> (the process is the product...the process produces itself).
> Brett

I am at a loss to respond to such disordered thinking.