Re: virus: Pascal's wager

chardin (
Wed, 15 Oct 1997 18:29:08 CST+6CDT

> Date: Wed, 15 Oct 1997 10:35:49 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Tim Rhodes <>
> To:
> Subject: Re: virus: Pascal's wager
> Reply-to:

> On Tue, 14 Oct 1997, chardin wrote:
> > > You might read on afterward as well. Where in the next sentence
> > > Jesus tells Peter he is a "rock" for seeing him as he is, BUT not to
> > > tell anyone else who he is! (Christians kinda dropped the ball on
> > > that one, eh?)
> > Drop the ball? I don't understand what you are saying. I remember
> > he said "Thou art Peter and upon this Rock (i.e., the revelation that
> > Jesus is Christ) I will built my church.
> Didn't read the next two lines did you?
> > Our we talking past each other?
> Beginning to look that way.
I honestly have no idea what you are talking about.
>Didn't read the next two lines did you?

I told you I could not find what you
were talking about. If there are only two, would you be kind enough
to quote them for me.

> > > While you're reading (funny that I've read more of your Bible for
> > > this debate than you, the Believer, has isn't it? Huh?!?) you might
> > > go on to Matthew 13:10-17 for Jesus' reasons why HE ALWAYS TAUGHT IN
> > > PARABLES! Do you read parables literally? You shouldn't. They are
> > > analogies, not to be taken word-for-word. That is how Jesus taught.
> > > To bad it is not how his followers learn!!! ("Like seeds on rocky
> > > ground")
> > It is true that Jesus teaches in parables--which is again,
> > fulfillment of prophecy--are you going to make me look up the quote?
> > But everything is not always a parable--I beg to differ with your use
> > of the word "always."
> Yes, I am going to make you look it up. If you are going to rest your
> eternal soul on the teachings of a book, you'd damn well better know that
> book backward an forward. You don't.
Well, I don't mind looking it up. Any excuse to get into the Bible
is fine with me. I think I understand what you are saying here. You
are saying that when he spoke to the multitudes he always taught them
in parables. I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying that there wasn't
a time when Jesus did not use parables. But you are right, when he
spoke to the multitudes--he "always" spoke in parables.

To that poor pitiful flock who did not understand Jesus' message--the
ones who were unconverted, he spoke to them as a father to his
children. "Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they
seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they
understand...For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears
are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any
time they should see with their eyes and hear with their heart, and
SHOULD BE CONVERTED (emphasis mine) and I should heal them. But
blessed are your eyes, for they see, and your ears for they hear."

"All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and
without a parable spake he not unto them; that it might be fulfulled
which was spoken by the prophet saying I will open my mouth in
parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the
foundation fo the world. Mat. 13:34-35---See Psalm 78:2.

To those who are converted, they know the "mysteries of the kingdom"
(v. 11)--to them it is given.

> Open it up again and read!!!
> > > He also said, "The Lord is the lord of the living and not the dead."
> > > Jesus didn't really give a hoot about an afterlife. His ministry
> > > was always about life and *how to live it*, not about were you go
> > > after you die. (The "I go to prepare a house for you"? Check it
> > > out. It is a *PARABLE*!!! Even says so in the beginning!)
> >
> > Yes, he is the Lord of the living and not the dead. "Whosoever
> > believeth in me shall never die."
> No. The next line is, "Let the dead bury their own dead". READ!!!

Jesus was talking about putting all worldy concerns aside if you are
going to follow Him. If I recall correctly, Tim, one man came to
Jesus and said he wanted to follow him, but first he needed to go
back and bury one of his parents, whereupon Jesus makes the remark
you are quoting. Jesus said "let the dead bury their dead" i.e.,
those left behind were dead in spirit, while those who follow Christ
are alive. So, let the dead in spirit bury the one dead in body--
He also said that he who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is
not fit to be a worker--but what are you trying to prove with your
quote? I really don't understand--I'm not trying to be difficult.

The point you are trying to make, Tim, I think is that everything
Jesus said was a parable. That is not true. When he taught the
multitudes he used the parable as a teaching tool. But he also
answered direct questions and commented on other aspects of his
ministry and these were not parables.

Jesus is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob--who are alive. The
scriptures teach us that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were saved because
of their looking forward to the advent of Christ. The resecurrection
of the dead is not a parable. God is a living God--he is not the God
of the dead but of the living. David remarked on this when he said
that God would not leave his soul in "sheol" I believe is the word he
used. David, too, was looking for the advent of Christ. It was for
this reason that Christ came into the world to die, that we might
have "eternal life." --ever lasting life.

> > The rest of the scriptures just don't bear you out. Chardin
> How would you know? Ever *read* them?
> > -Prof. Tim (quiz-team captain, `83)
I will be happy to discuss anyof these further. FOR GOD SO LOVED THE
gospel. The Christain has something other than the grave to look
forward to. As Paul said, because of Christ, Grave where is your
victory and death where is your sting?