Re: virus: DE natured IN solence

Brett Lane Robertson (unameit@tctc.com)
Sun, 25 Jan 1998 22:42:37 -0500


You have been asked to specify a mechanism by which a self-ordering meme
could order itself and replicate. Just as a vial of virus material can't
continue to make copies of itself it the vial by itself, why should a
meme be asked to so much as order itself? If a meme is truly as effective
as it can get, then variations will not be passed on as well and will not
be able to last as well. If a variation is more effective, then it will
be the one that maintains its own order. And this will not happen because
it tried to maintain its order. It only looks that way.(Tom)

Tom,

I don't think anyone has seen a meme so it can't be described. It is
usually talked about by the effect it has. The effect of a meme is that the
best ideas are passed on from one person to another.

Because memes might have a certain form or act in a certain way, it might
also be that not only the best ideas get passed on, but the best-formed
memes. That's why I don't think that looking at *how* ideas get passed on
is the best way to study memes (not as good as studying how the meme must be
structured).

I have tried to draw a picture of the way ideas interact with each other so
that certain things might happen...these "things" are the things that memes
are said to do: evolve, get passed on, and change the structure (memeplex)
of the new host in such a way that the meme gets "reproduced" by the host
(the ideas of the host organize themselves the same way that the meme was
organized).

Other offshoots of memetics complicate this picture. Perhaps there is a
memetic structure that might be called "virus" which performs one stage of
the meme's cycle (organize, infect, replicate). Saying that "If a meme is
truly as effective
as it can get, then variations will not be passed on..." only suggests that
the first stage meme (organize) should not be the only stage studied--true,
if organize were the sum-total, there would be no infestation and no
replication.

I use "meme" to indicate the first cycle--organization. I have begun to use
"virus" to indicate an infectious meme. I draw different structures to show
organization and infection. These structures are different enough--in my
mind--to make this distinction.

So, I say that a meme is ordered into a "self" unit. I say that a virus is
ordered in such a way that it hooks into another unit. Using viri and DNA,
this would be like saying that DNA evolves by changing into a virus and
infecting "itself" (or another similar unit). None of these distinctions
are disallowed by the current definition of meme (or virus)...and the
distinctions I am making do not change the purported *behavior* of a meme.

I HAVE drawn the structures which would allow for order, transfer, and
replication of these units. I refer to these charts to describe why or why
not the suggestions brought up by members of this list would or would not
work. I have no problem with saying that a meme can be explained by
observing its behavior--transmitting ideas; however, I do not think that the
best interest of memetics is served by saying that the meme IS the idea itself.

Brett

http://members.tripod.com/~Brettman35/index.html
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