> In message <19980806203852.AAA26707@[128.103.64.153]>, Wade T.Smith
> <wade_smith@harvard.edu> writes
> >
> >Memes are in the
> >brain. Period. Where else, dammit? I stand firm in thinking there need to
> >be _experiments on/in/with the brain_, not 'studies' of cultural
> >artifacts.
>
> Memes are information, which has a particular kind of
> numerical identity: the *same* item of information can
> and does exist in more than one place, at one time. Or
> rather, instances of it do. "Information" derives
> from "form" (see http://www.faichney.org/synthesis/infomat/)
> and items of information are not material things, but
> shapes. You and I can both possess different copies of
> the *same* book. There's no trick to that usage -- it's
> perfectly straightforward. Because information is
> basically form, it is *not* matter, and therefore need
> not and in fact cannot be pinned down to any particular
> location. Memes do not reside within the brain -- which
> is not to say that there isn't *something* in the
> patterns of neural activity that corresponds to the
> hosting of a particular meme -- but the levels of
> description of neural activity and of memetics are so
> far apart that I'm rather sceptical about significant
> correlations ever being found. And meanwhile, some of us
> can be looking at cultural artifacts, which are quite
> good evidence of behaviour, which is precisely the same
> level of description as memetics. Two people whistling
> the same tune, host the same meme, no doubt whatsoever.
> --
> Robin
Does information derive from form, or from pattern? Morse code
messages do not care whether they are relayed visually or aurally,
nor whether one uses dot-dash, 0-1, or x-y icons, so long as the
positioning of each of the constituents comprises the proper pattern.
Joe